[Members] XSF membership: what does it mean?

jehan jehan at zemarmot.net
Wed Nov 5 07:22:32 CST 2008

> On Wed Nov  5 11:57:57 2008, Pedro Melo wrote:
>> If you are asking for attendance to the meeting as a proof of   
>> commitment, then this process will fail right here, IMHO. 

The whole email from Pedro is exactly what I was meaning myself in my last 
email. But he said it in far better words that I was able to! 

> Dave Cridland writes:
> I'm not suggesting that anyone who now fails to attend will be noted  as 
> not willing to help, but it's a good way to get involved, and to  make 
> oneself available for things that need doing.

Yes that's one good way, but not the only one. For my own, I work during the 
day, and I am often out the evening because I have many activities. Still I 
can find some time at other moment, but not always exactly at the time when 
you expect it (meetings). So I make myself available, but on my own 

> But yet we have specifications in Last Call, and almost complete  silence 
> - having a bunch of people reviewing them - both for  technical content 
> and for copy-editing and proof-reading - would be  great, and one way to 
> get that is for people to offer to do such  reviews, and we can assign 
> them to people. 
> Otherwise, from where I'm sitting, it's very hard to distinguish  between 
> an interested silence and complete apathy. 

Yes you are right. But sometimes we read stuffs others are saying, we read 
specs, discussions, or else, and just we agree, or we have no opinion on the 
current topic, etc. So we don't say much. Thus the question is: is it really 
good and useful to speak when we have nothing to say? 

But other times, we have an opinion and then we propose to help. Just the 
only things you have to do is: 

1/ share your issues! If you don't, we cannot guess. And as I said, we are 
not all leaders. For instance, we don't propose our help for the previous 
website you could not deal with, apparently after some former admin stopped 
managing it. Why? Because we didn't know there was a problem. But if you had 
said it on the list, maybe someone would have been able to help?.. Instead 
you just told that the website was changing when it had been done. 

2/ If you ask something, or if someone propose help on a matter, accept to 
share the job. I have already gave two examples of times when an help 
offered were rejected. I am sure there had been many others. 

We cannot all help the same way. We have all specific knowledge fields, some 
more technical, some as very good spec reviewer, and some even non-technical 
(which are able to do a lot of other stuffs I won't)! So you cannot expect 
only one side of the issue. I think, and I hope, that the XSF is not only 
about spec reviewing (of course that's a major part, because it is the 
"root" of the Foundation: the XMPP protocol).
So you have one example where you saw no reaction from the XSF members, 
that's true, but that's only seeing what you want to see. You should see 
what each member is seeing, then use each member through its own vision. 

> Incidentally, this isn't the only thing that needs doing, it's just  the 
> first thing to spring to mind. There's lots of (mostly very dull)  stuff 
> that probably needs doing, and could be done by a willing bunch  off XSF 
> members, but it's tricky to think in those terms when even  PSA appears to 
> think nobody is all that interested. 

He probably thinks so, but I don't think that's true. We are interested 
(all? Maybe not, but most I guess. Else why having subscribed?), but we 
don't know how we can help. You are the leaders, lead us! 


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