[Security] client-to-client security :: Summary and todo's

Pedro Melo melo at simplicidade.org
Sat Aug 23 09:15:57 CDT 2008


On Aug 23, 2008, at 2:28 PM, Jonathan Schleifer wrote:
> Am 23.08.2008 um 15:12 schrieb Dirk Meyer:
>> In that case we need a SOCKS5 proxy or a TURN server. I prefer the
>> TURN server but we lack ice-tcp support to use it.
>> I also need the server to help me find a TURN server I can use if I
>> need one.
> Well, I think we shouldn't use Jingle at all for transfering  
> encrypted messages. It just adds too much complexity IMO and I  
> don't always want a direct connection. Of course, I could use IBB,  
> but do we really need Jingle to transfer it in our XMPP stream? The  
> answer is clearly no. Plus, server admins might block IBB to save  
> traffic, because they don't want for example Jingle Video traffic  
> transfered in-band and thus disable Jingle IBB. I'm therefore for  
> not using Jingle as a transport layer, but have some transport  
> layer for c2c encryption only.

If you don't use Jingle, you'll have to create yet another  
negotiation protocol for encrypted/trusted streams. Also, if you push  
the negotiation of encrypted/trusted streams to Jingle, you can use  
them for other stuff, like secure file-transfer, secure- 
collaboration, etc.

Jingle is a negotiation protocol. If you don't want to use a direct  
connection, offer only IBB.

As for anti-IBB servers, well, I can only say that whatever in-band  
format you end up with, it will look a lot like IBB in the end. At  
least from a stanza-size perspective.

Sure, I understand that IBB can be a problem for some servers, but  
that is why current servers have shaping mechanisms.

Arguments about video-over-IBB are not valid in my view. Those who  
attempted such idiotic use of in-band resources would be stopped by  
the shaping rules. IBB is a must have for fallback purposes, for what  
I call "experience reliability": common stuff should always work.

One last point: if a client negotiates a high-bandwidth-protocol over  
IBB, I would classify that as a major bug of the client. Common sense  
alone should trigger big red flashing lights.

Best regards,
Pedro Melo
Blog: http://www.simplicidade.org/notes/
XMPP ID: melo at simplicidade.org

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