[JDEV] JUD docs?

Colin Madere colin at vedalabs.com
Thu Apr 12 13:36:22 CDT 2001

Assuming I go through with a JUD implementation, I will surely post any and
all info I come up with.

I'm usually good about getting docs done, so that would likely be done also.

Thanks for noting the doc situation guys, I've seen a marked improvement in
the last 6 months or so.  Keep up the great work!


> -----Original Message-----
> From: Iain Shigeoka [mailto:iainshigeoka at yahoo.com]
> Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2001 9:52 AM
> To: jdev at jabber.org; jab-docs at jabber.org
> Subject: Re: [JDEV] JUD docs?
> At 06:21 PM 4/9/2001 -0500, Colin Madere wrote:
> >I'm not looking to run the existing perl JUD, I'm looking to 
> implement in 
> >another language.
> >
> >Can anyone point me to a doc that would have all the 
> messages the JUD uses 
> >(specs on the messages)?  If we do this, I want to make sure 
> everything 
> >will work with existing and future clients.
> >
> >I'm know I'm a lazy bum for not going through all the JPG, 
> JPO, etc, but 
> >I've done so too many times in the past with the results 
> being fruitless 
> >:(  No offense, Peter (and others), I know you've been 
> adding TONS of info 
> >and kudos for it!
> This does seem to be a missing piece.  I browsed around and 
> couldn't find 
> good docs on it.  From my experience the current 
> documentation is very much 
> oriented towards writing clients.  If you're writing servers 
> or modules, 
> the docs are very sparse.
> We're working on spreading out the doc tasks (Peter is 
> definitely been 
> putting in heroic effort already) and I personally am hoping 
> to push for a 
> slight re-org of the docs to make sure there is at least one 
> for every 
> jabber module/protocol.  I personally would also like to push 
> for a better 
> separation of the docs.  There seems to be several doc audiences:
> "official" standards (protocol)
> client writer guide
> server writer guide
> module writer guide
> So, for example, the JUD standard will specify in as precise 
> a language as 
> we can, what JUD is, and its attached interactions and 
> protocols.  The 
> client writer's guide references the standard, and tries to 
> help writers of 
> clients deal with JUD (probably also referring to other 
> "standard" docs as 
> well).  Similarly, the server and module writer's guides will 
> also do the 
> same but from different perspectives.  These would include caveats, 
> tips/tricks, and implementation details/suggestions.
> I believe Peter is already in the process of doing this, but could 
> obviously use a lot more work.  :)  For now, the only 
> suggestion that I 
> have is: a) write your own version, submit it to jdev or 
> jab-docs.  writing 
> a guide really helps you to understand the tech.  And of 
> course, if there 
> are errors in your guide due to errors or gaps in your 
> knowledge hopefully 
> someone on the list will be able to help correct/fill-in the 
> gaps.  b) read 
> the source.  I know.  It bites but the source really is the 
> one and only 
> true standard we have right now for some of these things.  
> I've found the 
> docs to, at times be a bit ambiguous so the reference 
> implementation is 
> really the only way to check behavior...  Of course, if it is 
> ambigious 
> from the standard, you could help us specify it, and then 
> perhaps even 
> force the reference implementation to change to match the 
> standard.  :)
> -iain
> BTW - I'm interested in implementing a jabber server (including the 
> modules) so would be interested to hear if you do find out 
> anything.  I 
> would really appreciate either a post to the list or email 
> directly to me 
> with any JUD info you do find/figure out...  I've been looking and 
> semi-dreading implementing the JUD because its so sparsely 
> documented. :)
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