[jdev] conversing with multiple users, but not MUC

Toby Schaffer jts at adc.idt.com
Tue Jul 1 09:49:10 CDT 2008

That's a good point about dealing with non-XEP-0033 clients. But from my 
point-of-view I'm only concerned with getting /a/ solution - if that 
means requiring users here to use only pidgin (or whatever client) to 
get full benefit, that's ok. Graceful interaction with non-XEP-0033 
clients, while desirable, isn't a priority, I just need to be able to 
say "here's a way to get the job done".

I'm not familiar enough with XMPP to know exactly what's possible purely 
on the client side and what requires a server component, so thanks for 
the advice. Maybe I need to be soliciting work on the pidgin 
developers'  list instead... :)


Jeff McAdams wrote:
> Toby Schaffer wrote:
>> I hope nobody minds me bringing up an older thread... Responding to
>> Nathan's original reply
>> <http://mail.jabber.org/pipermail/jdev/2008-June/026983.html> that this
>> should be handled as a MUC which the client could make transparent, I'm
>> hoping for something that requires no interaction from the user, not
>> even having to accept a MUC invitation. 
> Again, its quite possible for a client to do this.  The protocol
> (particularly with the <continue/> element) has the necessary bits and
> parts to let the client know that it should be a seamless
> transition...both on the initiating, and receiving side.
> This is all client implementation issue.
>> Ideally, the message would
>> simply appear on the recipients' screens as if they were IM'd
>> individually (except for the other recipients' JIDs, of course). Again,
>> it seems that XEP-0033 addresses all this, and I'm surprised there are
>> no implementations.
> You are correct, though, in that you could use XEP-0033 capabilities to
> do this as well...though I suspect you're going to find a lot more
> interoperability corner cases when working with other clients that don't
> support XEP-0033.
> At least, with the MUC case, if you're interacting with a client that
> doesn't provide that seamless user experience, it will "gracefully" fall
> back to giving a MUC invite to the user to confirm.  If you're
> interacting with a client that doesn't support XEP-0033, your multi-way
> flow of messages isn't going to work the way I think you want/expect it
> to.  (ie, you send a XEP-0033 message to two people; one of them, with a
> non-XEP-0033 client, responds, and the message only comes to you, and
> not also to the other user...correct me if I'm wrong on this).
> I suspect this is why you haven't seen wide adoption of XEP-0033 as its
> usefulness is largely dependent on other clients implementing it as
> well...its the age-old bootstrapping problem.
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Toby Schaffer                          email: toby_schaffer at idt.com
CAD Engineer                           phone: 678-775-2969
Integrated Device Technology, Inc.
11555 Medlock Bridge Rd. Suite #200 Duluth, GA 30097

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