[Standards] admin->none, what happens to user if in member-only room

Peter Saint-Andre stpeter at stpeter.im
Wed Sep 21 23:33:02 UTC 2011

On 9/21/11 5:23 PM, Kurt Zeilenga wrote:
> On Sep 21, 2011, at 10:45 AM, Alexander Holler wrote:
>> Am 21.09.2011 03:03, schrieb Kurt Zeilenga:
>>> While XEP 45, Section 9.4 is reasonable clear that loss of
>>> membership causes a kick from the room, Section 10.7 is less
>>> clear of what happens on loss of admin privs.
>>> 10.7 says: If the user is in the room, the service MUST then send
>>> updated presence from this individual to all occupants,
>>> indicating the loss of administrative privileges by sending a
>>> presence element that contains an<x/>  element qualified by the
>>> 'http://jabber.org/protocol/muc#user' namespace and containing
>>> an<item/>  child with the 'affiliation' attribute set to a value
>>> other than "admin" or "owner" and the 'role' attribute set to an
>>> appropriate value given the affiliation level and the room type
>>> and then gives an example of showing the user moved to
>>> participant.
>>> It doesn't detail what actually is 'appropriate'.
>> Table 4 (5.1.2 Default Roles) shows what is appropriate.
> Where does this table, or anywhere in that section, does it say what
> actions are triggered due to the affiliation change?
> It's not.  Loss of admin affiliation is discussed in section 10… but
> without detail required to ensure consistent behavior.

I've never seen anyone lose their admin privileges, so I don't know how
important it is to have consistent behavior.

> Personally, I think the occupant which loss admin privs to a
> member-only room ought to be kicked.  Others might think otherwise.

Why not transition from admin to mere member? I don't see a reason to
kick or ban someone just because they're no longer an admin, even in a
members-only room. And in any case it all depends on what the owner does
(change affiliation from admin to member or admin to none or admin to


Peter Saint-Andre

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