4 Sep
2025
4 Sep
'25
7:34 p.m.
Thanks Goffi,
Thanks! I agree: it is desirable to have a section in XEP-0060 that allows
nodes to be discovered.
Am I right to assume that, in the context of XEP-0060 *without* XEP-0248,
this is a single service disco#items request (to the pubsub service JID),
that returns one result (possibly paginated/searchable)? If that is indeed
true, then I think we should replace examples 9, 10, 11 and 12 (and
corresponding texts) with just two examples that do 'only' that: this
removes significant complexity. What is now 9, 10, 11 and 12 should go into
XEP-0248.
As I explained in my previous email, I don't think that this is breaking
backwards compatibility.
However, if Node Discovery is important, as you state (and I am certainly
not arguing against that), then I think we need something extra. As I read
section 5.2 of XEP-0060, Node Discovery functionality is not mandatory: it
is a MUST *only *when the service implements a hierarchy of nodes. I don't
think that we can have a hierarchy of nodes without Collection Nodes /
XEP-0248, right? That means that it's not mandatory at all now. I think we
should consider changing that.
Summarizing, the desired changes:
1. Replace XEP-0248 Section 5.2 with much of the content that is now in
XEP-0060 Section 5.2.
2. Reduce XEP-0060 Section 5.2 to an example that does not include
hierarchy / Collection Nodes.
3. Add to XEP-0060 Section 5.2 that it must be possible to discover
nodes (even if there's no hierarchy). I would like to add a MUST condition
there, but given that this XEP is Stable, I don't know if we can. As this
change adds a new requirement, it may cause pre-existing implementations to
suddenly be no longer compliant. Is that "breaking backwards compatibility"
as defined in XEP-0001?
What do you think?
Kind regards,
Guus
On Thu, Sep 4, 2025 at 6:18 PM Goffi <goffi(a)goffi.org> wrote:
Le jeudi 4 septembre 2025, 15:52:25 heure d’été
d’Europe centrale Guus der
Kinderen a écrit :
Hello!
Section 5.2 of XEP-0060 'Publish-Subscribe' describes how disco#items is
used to discover nodes. Most of that section describes node discovery in
node hierarchies and collection nodes.
In version 1.12 of XEP-0060 text about collections was moved to XEP-0248
'PubSub Collection Nodes'. This specification contains a smaller
paragraph
on node discovery (which is also numbered 5.2).
I would like to see the complexity of XEP-0060 be reduced. I believe that
most, if not all of its section 5.2 should be moved to XEP-0248 and
removed
from XEP-0060.
The suggested change should not affect backwards compatibility, as it
doesn't result in a change of behavior: as far as I can see, the text
only
applies to hierarchies and collection nodes. The
change therefore is
permissible even considering XEP-0060 is Stable.
Is there any objection to this? What would relevant Node Discovery
content
for XEP-0060 be (other than a reference to
XEP-0248)?
Kind regards,
Guus
Hi Guus,
While I agree that the reference to collections, root and leaf nodes
should be
removed or moved away, node discovery is certainly useful in general
use-case
and should be part of XEP-0060 IMO.
The mechanism itself is a usual disco#items query, the section mostly
explain
how to interpret the result, so it doesn't really complexify the protocol.
Discovering nodes is useful (and used) to discovers things such as blogs,
XEP-0346 forms and other pubsub-based features.
Best,
Goffi_______________________________________________
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