[Foundation] Re: Members digest, Vol 1 #289 - 4 msgs

Mike Lin mikelin at MIT.EDU
Thu Aug 8 21:06:06 CDT 2002

> 1/ We just have three protocols sharing the same addressing RFC. Can we
> deduce anything regarding architecture from this statement ?

You design an addressing scheme to accomodate your routing architecture,
not vice versa. So, yes, one could reasonably infer from the fact that
SMTP, Jabber, and SIP use similar addressing schemes that they have
similar architectures. Which they do, regardless.

> 2/ You just gave the answer to the question yourself, let me quote you
> speaking of its client
> [ugly, inflexible, and with a stupid presence model ]
> Do we need to say more of an inadequate IM protocole ? And who would love
> using such an instant messaging client ? Or maybe were you just researching
> on IM "worst practices" ?

The SIMPLE protocol is ugly, inflexible, and has a stupid presence
model. The clients I was talking about are quite fine. I would go so far
as to say that they are better than most Jabber clients, but then they
are funded/staffed projects rather than open-source efforts, whatever
difference that makes.

SIMPLE is an "adequate", if not beautiful, protocol for instant
messaging. We have loftier goals for Jabber, but SIMPLE does what it was
designed to do.

> 3/ Yes indeed (another quote) [the guys who came up with it, for
> the most part, aren't just bumbling m...] but do you mean to say they are
> therefore entitled to detain the absolute truth and be right in every case ?
> Isn't that an easy shortcut to justification ?

I think that is pretty obviously not what I was saying if you look at
the entire statement except for the part you quoted. I'm not sure what
else to say.

> To make it short as jer say, some IM protocol just *work*


> Let's call it  a stop, will we ?

Despite the harsh feelings I think it's important for everyone working
on Jabber to understand what SIP/SIMPLE is, what it can/cannot achieve,
and especially what things we can learn from it, even if there are few
such things. So I don't think this little argument has been all that of
a bad thing.


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