[Foundation] voting update

Terry Smelser tsmelser at sltscommunications.net
Mon Mar 11 22:49:39 CST 2002

>I really hate to be infammatory -- but what exactly have you guys done
>for the *Foundation* community beyond write a book and work on closed
>source clients?

I wasn't refering to the FOUNDATION as a community, remember, I think it's a
"good ole boys club". I refer to Jabber and only Jabber as a community.
What have we done for Jabber?   Instead of me pointing that out....why don't
you look?  And keep looking, the release of our book will bring about
several changes in our setup here. Things that will benefit the entire
JABBER community...we hope anyway ( prolly won't do a thing for the "good
ole boys club", but was never ment to)

No we don't write a lot to any of the threads.... we found out right after
the beginnings of the Foundation, when we were pushing  for the resolution
of  some issues, (that are still unresolved)  that our input, our PUSHING,
was not welcome. We were ask to "stop rocking the boat", in open forum,
mailing lists and in private email (yes I still have copies of  all of it).
Foundation email is a source of information to me (and us) and that, you can
never have enough of.

So fine, it does not  bother any of us here to be the black sheep, we kind
of enjoy it. We have continued to work on our clients, build custom clients,
write a book on the setup and configuration of open source Jabber servers
and the design of OPEN source client software as well. We have pushed OUR
client first, and ANY Jabber client next. ( this is only fair and good for
business). I have written countless articles and letters about switching
users to Jabber and away from the big guys networks,  etc.. etc..  I will do
more and anything I can think of to promote "Jabber" and it's use. Again,
while I always push myJabber for windows, would you care to guess what I
push for Linux/Unix? :-) Only the best for my customers and users....

So what have I done for the Foundation? What I was ask to do... I shut up.

> I'm looking forward to your email about the copyright problems.

Unless I am instructed to do so by slts, I will not address the issue,
(other than to be sure WE don't take a hit) I tried in the very beginning,
all of us did. I simply do not have time to work where I am not wanted and
it was made clear to us that we were NOT welcome.

Jabber on the other hand has been kinder to me and I to it.

 I think this statement goes for all of us here at slts, if it don't you can
be SURE I will hear about it in the morning.

Terry Smelser
System Specialist

----- Original Message -----
From: "Julian Missig" <julian at jabber.org>
To: <members at jabber.org>
Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002 8:54 PM
Subject: Re: [Foundation] voting update

> On Mon, 2002-03-11 at 22:35, Terry Smelser wrote:
> > And this has what to do with the fact that drivel is drivel??  It occurs
> > me that while a little bit of color is harmless and perhaps even useful,
> > some of us just don't have the time for it.  I have been getting PILES
> > foundation mail here as of late, little of it has been worth the drive
> > it consumes.
> Looking through the most recent mails, I only see a handful which I
> would consider useless. Most of them seem to be people trying to sort
> out problems... and I think we're arriving at the core of the
> foundation's current problems.
> >
> >   And NO I would not consider removing myself from the lists, because
> > by accident, something that I might really want to read may come though.
> > Foundation, so far, has taken on all of the qualities of a "good ole
> > club" and not much else.
> >
> > Example:
> >
> >  We here at slts (myJabber) do NOT use the Powered by Jabber logos,
there is
> > a copyright violation involved in using them. It was and IS the
> > position to resolve that issue. Instead, the leadership of it (in this
> > YOU) has seen fit to reprimand a member for stating his opinion, while
> > defending others for stating theirs. Or at least exercising their right
> > free speech.
> So bring up your issues with the trademark and copyright in the thread!
> The reason the discussion on it has fizzled is because no one has said
> anything about it. Jabber, Inc. is not going to start bringing up
> problems on its own, you guys need to talk about them.
> If you have so many problems with the copyrights and leadership of the
> foundation, where did you make these problems known? I haven't seen
> anywhere near as much noise from @sltscommunications.net email addresses
> for any other thread. In fact, I don't see a single email from any of
> you on the "Jabber (TM)" thread -- and you claim that is one of your
> problems.
> *If you have issues with the leadership or copyright issues, make noise
> about it.* Not random noise just whining about it like I am sometimes
> guilty of doing -- make a logical, well-drawn argument for your point.
> Mike Lin does this very well (sometimes too well ;) ).
> And I'm really clueless about this "reprimand[ing] a member for stating
> his opinion" -- could someone please point me to this?
> >
> >
> >
> > Let's get on the ball here and resolve a few issues that affect all of
> > instead of an issue that involved ONE person.
> I'm looking forward to your email about the copyright problems.
> >
> >
> >
> > I have NO doubt that Peter and DJ have contributed an amazing amount to
> > Jabber Community; in fact I am quite sure of it.  I have received a lot
> > help, both directly and indirectly from both of them. AND from a lot of
> > other guys that are not perhaps as high profile as these two. A lot of
> > have contributed in many ways, Steve Lee and I wrote a book that will
> > release next week, (Hungry Minds)  I can't wait to get a chance to Read
> > book, But we at slts can achieve more in a part time afternoon, (we
> > have jobs) than frankly the foundation has achieved  from the time of
> > inception.
> I really hate to be infammatory -- but what exactly have you guys done
> for the *Foundation* community beyond write a book and work on closed
> source clients? I have spent time trying to move the foundation forward.
> I like to think I'm partially responsible for the recent boom in number
> of JEPs, and I continue to work on more. I'm pushing to get the Council
> to actually vote on these JEPs, as stpeter can attest to.
> > Never the less, we are either a community or we are not. Most of us are
> > treating this as a business now days, we don't have time for drivel,
> > regardless of WHO is responsible for it.
> Fine, but this is still about fun for me.
> Julian
> --
> email: julian at jabber.org
> jabber:julian at jabber.org
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