[Foundation] voting update

Peter Saint-Andre stpeter at jabber.org
Tue Mar 12 11:52:00 CST 2002


Hey Michael, even in jest such a suggestion is out of line.

Peter

--
Peter Saint-Andre
email+jabber: stpeter at jabber.org
weblog: http://www.saint-andre.com/blog/

On Tue, 12 Mar 2002, Michael Bauer wrote:

> 
> Under Section 3.12 of the By-Laws of the Jabber Software Foundation, I am 
> calling for additional members to join me in forming a bloc of 5% of the 
> Membership to call for a full vote of the current Membership; the
> intention of this full vote would be to attain a 2/3 majority under 
> Section 2.5 of the By-Laws of the Jabber Software Foundation to remove all 
> members of sltsCommunications from membership in the Jabber Software 
> Foundation.
> 
> 
> On Mon, 11 Mar 2002, Terry Smelser wrote:
> 
> > >I really hate to be infammatory -- but what exactly have you guys done
> > >for the *Foundation* community beyond write a book and work on closed
> > >source clients?
> > 
> > I wasn't refering to the FOUNDATION as a community, remember, I think it's a
> > "good ole boys club". I refer to Jabber and only Jabber as a community.
> > What have we done for Jabber?   Instead of me pointing that out....why don't
> > you look?  And keep looking, the release of our book will bring about
> > several changes in our setup here. Things that will benefit the entire
> > JABBER community...we hope anyway ( prolly won't do a thing for the "good
> > ole boys club", but was never ment to)
> > 
> > 
> > No we don't write a lot to any of the threads.... we found out right after
> > the beginnings of the Foundation, when we were pushing  for the resolution
> > of  some issues, (that are still unresolved)  that our input, our PUSHING,
> > was not welcome. We were ask to "stop rocking the boat", in open forum,
> > mailing lists and in private email (yes I still have copies of  all of it).
> > Foundation email is a source of information to me (and us) and that, you can
> > never have enough of.
> > 
> > So fine, it does not  bother any of us here to be the black sheep, we kind
> > of enjoy it. We have continued to work on our clients, build custom clients,
> > write a book on the setup and configuration of open source Jabber servers
> > and the design of OPEN source client software as well. We have pushed OUR
> > client first, and ANY Jabber client next. ( this is only fair and good for
> > business). I have written countless articles and letters about switching
> > users to Jabber and away from the big guys networks,  etc.. etc..  I will do
> > more and anything I can think of to promote "Jabber" and it's use. Again,
> > while I always push myJabber for windows, would you care to guess what I
> > push for Linux/Unix? :-) Only the best for my customers and users....
> > 
> > So what have I done for the Foundation? What I was ask to do... I shut up.
> > 
> > > I'm looking forward to your email about the copyright problems.
> > 
> > Unless I am instructed to do so by slts, I will not address the issue,
> > (other than to be sure WE don't take a hit) I tried in the very beginning,
> > all of us did. I simply do not have time to work where I am not wanted and
> > it was made clear to us that we were NOT welcome.
> > 
> > Jabber on the other hand has been kinder to me and I to it.
> > 
> >  I think this statement goes for all of us here at slts, if it don't you can
> > be SURE I will hear about it in the morning.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Terry Smelser
> > System Specialist
> > sltsCommunications
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Julian Missig" <julian at jabber.org>
> > To: <members at jabber.org>
> > Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002 8:54 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Foundation] voting update
> > 
> > 
> > > On Mon, 2002-03-11 at 22:35, Terry Smelser wrote:
> > > > And this has what to do with the fact that drivel is drivel??  It occurs
> > to
> > > > me that while a little bit of color is harmless and perhaps even useful,
> > > > some of us just don't have the time for it.  I have been getting PILES
> > of
> > > > foundation mail here as of late, little of it has been worth the drive
> > space
> > > > it consumes.
> > >
> > > Looking through the most recent mails, I only see a handful which I
> > > would consider useless. Most of them seem to be people trying to sort
> > > out problems... and I think we're arriving at the core of the
> > > foundation's current problems.
> > >
> > > >
> > > >   And NO I would not consider removing myself from the lists, because
> > just
> > > > by accident, something that I might really want to read may come though.
> > The
> > > > Foundation, so far, has taken on all of the qualities of a "good ole
> > boys
> > > > club" and not much else.
> > > >
> > > > Example:
> > > >
> > > >  We here at slts (myJabber) do NOT use the Powered by Jabber logos,
> > there is
> > > > a copyright violation involved in using them. It was and IS the
> > foundation's
> > > > position to resolve that issue. Instead, the leadership of it (in this
> > case
> > > > YOU) has seen fit to reprimand a member for stating his opinion, while
> > > > defending others for stating theirs. Or at least exercising their right
> > to
> > > > free speech.
> > >
> > > So bring up your issues with the trademark and copyright in the thread!
> > > The reason the discussion on it has fizzled is because no one has said
> > > anything about it. Jabber, Inc. is not going to start bringing up
> > > problems on its own, you guys need to talk about them.
> > >
> > > If you have so many problems with the copyrights and leadership of the
> > > foundation, where did you make these problems known? I haven't seen
> > > anywhere near as much noise from @sltscommunications.net email addresses
> > > for any other thread. In fact, I don't see a single email from any of
> > > you on the "Jabber (TM)" thread -- and you claim that is one of your
> > > problems.
> > >
> > > *If you have issues with the leadership or copyright issues, make noise
> > > about it.* Not random noise just whining about it like I am sometimes
> > > guilty of doing -- make a logical, well-drawn argument for your point.
> > > Mike Lin does this very well (sometimes too well ;) ).
> > >
> > > And I'm really clueless about this "reprimand[ing] a member for stating
> > > his opinion" -- could someone please point me to this?
> > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Let's get on the ball here and resolve a few issues that affect all of
> > us,
> > > > instead of an issue that involved ONE person.
> > >
> > > I'm looking forward to your email about the copyright problems.
> > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > I have NO doubt that Peter and DJ have contributed an amazing amount to
> > the
> > > > Jabber Community; in fact I am quite sure of it.  I have received a lot
> > of
> > > > help, both directly and indirectly from both of them. AND from a lot of
> > > > other guys that are not perhaps as high profile as these two. A lot of
> > us
> > > > have contributed in many ways, Steve Lee and I wrote a book that will
> > > > release next week, (Hungry Minds)  I can't wait to get a chance to Read
> > DJ's
> > > > book, But we at slts can achieve more in a part time afternoon, (we
> > still
> > > > have jobs) than frankly the foundation has achieved  from the time of
> > it's
> > > > inception.
> > >
> > > I really hate to be infammatory -- but what exactly have you guys done
> > > for the *Foundation* community beyond write a book and work on closed
> > > source clients? I have spent time trying to move the foundation forward.
> > > I like to think I'm partially responsible for the recent boom in number
> > > of JEPs, and I continue to work on more. I'm pushing to get the Council
> > > to actually vote on these JEPs, as stpeter can attest to.
> > >
> > > > Never the less, we are either a community or we are not. Most of us are
> > > > treating this as a business now days, we don't have time for drivel,
> > > > regardless of WHO is responsible for it.
> > >
> > > Fine, but this is still about fun for me.
> > >
> > > Julian
> > > --
> > > email: julian at jabber.org
> > > jabber:julian at jabber.org
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Members mailing list
> > > Members at jabber.org
> > > http://mailman.jabber.org/listinfo/members
> > >
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Members mailing list
> > Members at jabber.org
> > http://mailman.jabber.org/listinfo/members
> > 
> 
> -- 
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Michael Bauer        me at michaelbauer.com       http://www.michaelbauer.com
> 
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> 




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