AW: [standards-jig] JEP-0022 composing Events

Peter Saint-Andre stpeter at jabber.org
Mon May 5 22:19:36 UTC 2003


No servers are involved with the composing events. If we want something
more triumphant, we may need to replace the existing protocol or
seriously revamp it.

Peter

On Sun, May 04, 2003 at 01:45:30PM -0500, Frank Gates wrote:
> Ok, this reply is only 2 1/2 months later than the rest... i just saw it...
> But does relate to Open Issues (6).
> 
> Question..  If a Composing Event is sent by the client (rf.2.4 of
> jep-0022.html) but is not canceled, can the jabber server tell if the client
> locked up, crashed or was otherwise closed or made unavailable?   One
> possibility is to use a JINI-like Leasing protocol.   In this case a Composing
> Event establishes a "lease" with the receiver for some amount of time (which
> could be specified by the composing event or other mechanism)..   If the client
> doesn't renew the lease in that time period the event would be automatically
> canceled.
> 
> e.g.,
> 
> A.)
>       <x xmlns='jabber:x:event'>
>             <composing lease="2000"/>
>             <id>message22</id>
>           </x>
> 
> or perhaps
> 
> B.)
>      <x xmlns='jabber:x:event'>
>             <composing/>
>             <lease time="2000"/>
>             <id>message22</id>
>           </x>
> 
> would establish a lease for 2000 ms.  Subsequent renewals would not require the
> lease element or attribute.
> 
> e.g.,
> renewal A.)
>      <x xmlns='jabber:x:event'>
>             <composing/>
>             <id>message22</id>
>           </x>
> 
> or,
> renewal B.)
>      <x xmlns='jabber:x:event'>
>             <composing/>
>             <renewal />                // if an explicit element is desired to
> indicate a renewal
>             <id>message22</id>
>           </x>
> 
> 
> 
> So, if the lease is not renewed the receiving clients would assume the
> composing event is canceled.   A composing event would then be canceled by
> either explicit cancellation or by failure to renew the lease.  (Explicit
> requests to cancel an event after it's lease has lapsed should be ignored.)  I
> would assume that explicit cancellation would be the norm.
> 
> If the original Composing Event does not include a lease, then either a default
> timeout could be implied for the lease period or otherwise the leasing protocol
> not used.  This leasing mechanism could also be applied to other Jabber events
> and protocols as appropriate.
> 
> While this is reminiscent of the MS patent, you would be drawing on other
> public domain protocols (Sun Microsystems's JINI) as a reference for your
> implementation.
> 
> By the way, this is my first response on this list.   Hope this isn't out of
> line.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> frank gates
> 
> 
> 
> Alexander Gnauck wrote:
> 
> > from MS Patent:
> > ==
> > The system periodically sends a new activity message at intervals
> > corresponding to
> > the first predetermined time interval so long as the user is actively
> > entering data during each time interval
> > ==
> >
> > Thast a difference here to jabber. We send our events not periodical. We
> > send them, and we cancel them. So i think we dont infringe this patent. But
> > im a programmer and not a lawyer.
> >
> > Alex
> >
> > > Alexander Gnauck's questions may be mute since Microsoft has recently
> > > received a patent (US 6,519,639) on the "activity monitoring" which is
> > > the core of any method of implementing "composing event."
> > >
> > >The system
> > periodically sends a new activity message at intervals corresponding to
> > the first predetermined time interval so long as the user is actively
> > entering data during each time interval/2003-February/000076.html
> > >
> > > I would suggest that folk interested in JEP-0022's composing event
> > > carefully study the Microsoft patent to determine if continuing with
> > > JEP-0022 would be an infringement. Perhaps Microsoft will consider
> > > licensing to Jabber?
> > >
> > >               bob wyman
> > >
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: standards-jig-admin at jabber.org
> > > [mailto:standards-jig-admin at jabber.org] On Behalf Of Alexander Gnauck
> > > Sent: Saturday, February 01, 2003 2:39 PM
> > > To: standards-jig at jabber.org
> > > Subject: AW: [standards-jig] JEP-0022 composing Events
> > >
> > >
> > > Hello,
> > >
> > > try to explain my problem again.
> > >
> > > RECV:
> > > <message from="srlee at myjabber.net/Home" to="gnauck at myjabber.net/Home"
> > > id="MX_10">
> > >     <body>Hello.  Are you there?</body>
> > >     <x xmlns="jabber:x:event">
> > >       <composing/>
> > >     </x>
> > > </message>
> > >
> > > i receive a message from srlee. Then i have to fetch the ID for my
> > > composing event. I start to type a chat message and send a composing
> > > Event to him
> > >
> > > SEND:
> > > <message from="gnauck at myjabber.net/Home" to="srlee at myjabber.net/Home">
> > >     <x xmlns="jabber:x:event">
> > >       <composing/>
> > >       <id>MX_10</id>
> > >     </x>
> > > </message>
> > >
> > > srlee receives this Event and his client shows in statusbar of the chat
> > > window "Alex is typing a message". Now my message is finished and i send
> > > it. And of course always with the information that i support composing
> > > events.
> > >
> > > SEND:
> > > <message from="gnauck at myjabber.net/Home" to="srlee at myjabber.net/Home"
> > > id="MX_210">
> > >     <body>Yes im there, how are you doing today?</body>
> > >       <x xmlns="jabber:x:event">
> > >               <composing/>
> > >       </x>
> > > </message>
> > >
> > > srlee receives this message and removes the "Alex is typing a message"
> > > from the statusbar of the chatwindow. Now i want to send him another
> > > message. But havent received a new message from him. So i have NO new ID
> > > and i cant send the MX_10 again. But i want to show him again that i am
> > > typing a message. What to do now ? Can i create a new ID and send a
> > > normal composing event ?
> > >
> > > Alex
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Standards-JIG mailing list
> > > Standards-JIG at jabber.org
> > > http://mailman.jabber.org/listinfo/standards-jig
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Standards-JIG mailing list
> > > Standards-JIG at jabber.org
> > > http://mailman.jabber.org/listinfo/standards-jig
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Standards-JIG mailing list
> > Standards-JIG at jabber.org
> > http://mailman.jabber.org/listinfo/standards-jig
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Standards-JIG mailing list
> Standards-JIG at jabber.org
> http://mailman.jabber.org/listinfo/standards-jig

-- 
Peter Saint-Andre
Jabber Software Foundation
http://www.jabber.org/people/stpeter.php



More information about the Standards mailing list