[Standards-JIG] Extended user info updates

Julian Missig julian at jabber.org
Thu Mar 17 15:11:39 UTC 2005

On 17 Mar 2005, at 9:52 , Richard Dobson wrote:

>> That said, my greater point is that right now the interfaces for   
>> <status> may not be good enough if MSN users are complaining that   
>> they need this nickname-changing functionality.
> The main thing that confuses them is that they dont see all of this  
> extra stuff that they are sticking into the nickname as "status"  
> information, and thus they are confused as to where to put it and  
> frustrated that it doesnt allow them to do what MSN allows them to  
> do and change their nickname to reflect this, so the whole problem  
> is the use of the word "status", im not sure what can be done about  
> this other than use a word other than "status".

But /that/ is an interface issue, not a protocol issue! My main  
problem with all of these arguments about extended presence  
information is that people keep confusing protocol issues with  
interface issues and then they use the interface issues to argue for  
need of a new protocol.

No one anywhere at any time decreed that all Jabber client authors  
must use protocol terminology in their clients (ok, ok, some people  
did argue that all clients should always use the same terms, but it  
wasn't decreed or agreed upon)--yet client authors still feel  
compelled to use Jabber terminology even when it's not appropriate.

> There is also the problem that this "nickname" information or  
> whatever you want to call it is something distinctly different from  
> what they want to express in their status information, i.e. the  
> might want to say "has a new car", but when they get into the  
> shower they also want to express "in the shower" or "on the phone"  
> or whatever without loosing the "has a new car" status information  
> which is what they could do in MSN, use the display_name for this  
> "nickname" info and use the presence status stuff to express "on  
> the phone" or "busy" or "out for a meeting, be back at 5".

Ok, now /this/ is a protocol issue.

I wouldn't call "has new car" by the term "nickname" under any  
circumstance except those in which I'm designing an interface for ex- 
MSN users.

Now I can understand why you would want this permanent status  
information in addition to presence-based status information, and it  
certainly does seem along the lines of User Mood and other things  
Ralph is interested in. Please don't call it "nickname" and don't  
confuse it with separate interface issues which MSN users are having.


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