[Standards] XEP-0184: <received/> vs. <displayed/> vs. <read/>

Kevin Smith kevin at kismith.co.uk
Wed Jun 16 18:41:45 UTC 2010

On Wed, Jun 16, 2010 at 7:35 PM, Yann Leboulanger <asterix at lagaule.org> wrote:
> On 06/16/2010 08:27 PM, Kevin Smith wrote:
>> On Wed, Jun 16, 2010 at 7:21 PM, Yann Leboulanger<asterix at lagaule.org>
>>  wrote:
>>> On 06/16/2010 08:15 PM, Kevin Smith wrote:
>>>> On Wed, Jun 16, 2010 at 7:04 PM, Peter Saint-Andre<stpeter at stpeter.im>
>>>>  wrote:
>>>>> I just had an interesting conversation with "yagiza" about XEP-0184,
>>>>> which he has said I can paste here. The general idea is: do we need
>>>>> something in XEP-0184 to indicate that a message has been read by the
>>>>> intended recipient? This would be similar to the<displayed/>    element
>>>>> in
>>>>> XEP-0022. I'm not convinced that we need this feature in XEP-0184, and
>>>>> tried to explain why to yagiza. Further discussion is welcome on this
>>>>> list. I've attached the log of my chat with yagiza for context.
>>>> The text already says that the receipt isn't sent until the message is
>>>> presented to the user, which seems to be exactly the behaviour
>>>> discussed - that the message was in the window the user had selected
>>>> at the time. So the XEP already covers this.
>>>> What it doesn't cover is acking messages as soon as the client has
>>>> received them and before they're presented to the user -  we have 198
>>>> to do exactly that.
>>> It's not what I understood from this XEP, and it's not what is
>>> implemented
>>> in Gajim.
>>> Requirements says "Enable a sender to request notification that an XMPP
>>> message stanza has been received." received here doesn't mean displayed
>>> IMHO.
>> I think the following text makes it clear, though:
>> 'Specifically, the receiving entity shall return a<received/>  notice
>> if it has received and processed the message. The term "processed" is
>> understood to include presentation to a human user if appropriate or
>> any other application-specific client-side processing'
> I think it just means that user has been notified that a message has been
> received, but not that message has been displayed.

I just checked the thesaurus to be sure I wasn't saying something
silly, and 'presentation' and 'display' are synonyms.

I think the sensible trigger for this is either after the user clicks
'read' if the client has such an interface, or after they've viewed
the message - XEP-0184 is analogous to read receipts in email, and
those are the behaviours typical there.


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