[Standards] [XEP-0372] References and mention
goffi at goffi.org
Wed Apr 20 17:20:53 UTC 2016
I finally had an answer for my requests on mentions and references, but I still
find it incomplete. So I'm trying to explain my points here so we can move
forward on this subject.
1) who is sending the notification ?
correct me if I'm wrong, but as I understand references right now, if Juliet
is mentioned somewhere, she can receive a message with an "anchor" attribute,
something like (in reference to example 3 in XEP-0372):
to='juliet at capulet.lit'>
<body>But, soft! what light through yonder window breaks? It is the east,
and Juliet is the sun.</body>
uri='xmpp:juliet at capulet.lit'
anchor='xmpp:balcony at chat.shakespeare.lit?message;id=sotehu-
note that the uri in anchor is not standard, I've made it up because there is
currently no standard URI scheme for a message (see #2).
So who is sending this notification? The XEP says "a service could listen for
mentions in a MIX channels of users outside that channel, and send them
messages containing a reference to let them know that they've been
mentioned.", but what it there is no linked service?
Use case: I have a picture on my laptop, and I tag somebody on it (says
Juliet), I want to notify her so she can request it with Jingle. Should my
client send this notification? Then on a PubSub/MUC/MIX/Whatever what if there
is also a service which monitor and send mention references? Or several? It
may result in tons of notifications
2) no URI scheme
This is not directly related to references but sound like a major problem at
the moment to me: we have no URI scheme to
- reference a chat message
- reference a whole stanza
- reference a jingle file
Maybe XEP-0359 can be somehow reused to build an URI, but this definitely need
3) no author
In my proposal (http://xmpp.org/extensions/inbox/jid-mention.html), section
4.4, there is the notion of "author" which doesn't exists in XEP-0372. This is
needed when a mention is done outside of XMPP and relayed by a XMPP service.
use case: Juliet is writting a thesis on Love and balconies and mention
Charles Baudelaire in a pdf. A XMPP service (mention.capulet.lit) detect it
and send a mention reference to Charles, but the emitting jid is the one of
the XMPP service (mention.capulet.lit) and so Charles has no way to know that
the mention came from juliet.
4) stanza mention
as I pointed out in my previous message (08/02/2016 12:20), it is not possible
to mention an element of a stanza (which is a critical case for mentions in
blog). This point need to be solved, what about some form of xpath in an
5) minor remarks
in addition to my previous remarks (message from 08/02/2016 12:20), there a
- it would be nice to add a glossary specifying what is a "referring
message". It's quite obvious, but still it may help in a specification
- in example 4 pubsub URI is invalid, fixed version is
- section 3.1 talks about begin, end and anchor "elements" but they are
And I think that's it. I'm willing to implement mentions in our client, but
these points are still blocking, and I hope we can solve this quickly.
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