[Standards] Obsoleting vCard-Based Avatars

Kevin Smith kevin.smith at isode.com
Wed Jan 11 19:56:43 UTC 2017

> On 11 Jan 2017, at 16:44, Sam Whited <sam at samwhited.com> wrote:
> On Tue, Jan 10, 2017 at 11:04 AM, Kevin Smith <kevin.smith at isode.com> wrote:
>> FWIW, give the remaining widespread deployment of vcard avatars compared to
>> pubsub-based, and of reported lack of interop between 84 implementations
>> (I'm sure I remember being told that some clients aren't sending mandatory
>> formats), it seems premature to me to obsolete these.
> In my mind this shouldn't be a consideration; if you don't give people
> a compelling reason to upgrade, I don't think they will. Normally this
> would be in the form of new features, or something that's easier to
> maintain. In this case, however, 0084 doesn't provide anything but
> better infrastructure to build on (and no one cares about
> infrastructure, it's not shiny enough).

If there isn’t a significant motivation to move from 153 to 84, I’m not sure why we need to push to move from 153 to 84.

> Simiarly, some clients not
> sending mandatory formats doesn't seem like a reason not to use 0084
> (clients could just as easily send a different format via 0153).

Well, saying “Don’t do 153” (with which you’d interop fine), “do 84 instead” (and don’t expect to interop) wouldn’t be a very strong argument, I think :)

> If we want the ecosystem to move forward, I think the closest thing we
> can provide to a compelling reason is to make 0084 the only
> recommendation for new implementations (old implementations will fall
> into line when they're no longer compatible with any of the shiny new
> clients). Right now there are two separate XEPs which serve the same
> purpose, and both show up on xmpp.org with green text at the top. The
> confusion this causes is, in my opinion, much worse than the
> outstanding issues with 0084, and by encouraging implementations of
> 0084 by making it the only recommendation we may also encourage
> contributions to fix those outstanding issues.

I’m obviously just about the last person to say we shouldn’t be trying to modernise XMPP, given mix, bind2, etc., but this just doesn’t seem like an area worth much effort as things stand.


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