[Standards] Proposed XMPP Extension: Styling

Sam Whited sam at samwhited.com
Mon Nov 6 19:31:32 UTC 2017

On Mon, Nov 6, 2017, at 13:17, Emmanuel Gil Peyrot wrote:
> Markdown(-like) is NOT a plain text format, having the receiving client
> choose between rendering all formatting characters or stripping them is
> stupid, and requiring humans to mentally strip them out in older
> clients is stupid; have you not seen the mess that OTR is for example?

It seems to work just fine for everyone else (Whatsapp, Slack, etc.).
I do not see how this is comparable to OTR or why it would cause any of
the same problems since the format is perfectly readable and ordinary
human beings use Whatsapp and appear to be happy with it.

> There is exactly no extensibility in this proposal, if tomorrow the
> trend changes you will end up with all users of clients implementing it
> not understanding what’s going on.

I do not think this is a problem. I also have no problem adding
formatting characters similar to the ones already in this spec and
changing the formatting of older messages.

> Formatting really should be in a separate payload, so that clients
> which don’t understand it can use the plain text version and safely
> ignore the formatted one.

This message *is* plaintext. It works fine. Meanwhile, when it is a
separate payload I have to worry about whether the messages are actually
the same (which is an interesting attack vector I'd like to explore in
XHTML-IM at some point), whether they're both encrypted, etc.

> And again, this XEP does not address any of the issues with XHTML-IM,
> web people will just pipe this through the first Markdown library and
> get rendering wrong, get more elements than listed here, and get a nice
> passthrough of escaped HTML.

This spec does not use Markdown, nor is it compatible with markdown, so
if people use a Markdown library they won't get the same formatting
described in this spec.


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