[Standards] [Council] 2018-02-28 Council Meeting Minutes

Dave Cridland dave at cridland.net
Wed Feb 28 17:15:36 UTC 2018

Thanks for these. As a reminder to those reading, Council would
*really* welcome any volunteers for writing these minutes - it's a
great way to get involved.

On 28 February 2018 at 16:58, Georg Lukas <georg at op-co.de> wrote:
> # 2018-02-28 Council Meeting Minutes
> Logs: http://logs.xmpp.org/council/2018-02-28/#16:00:13
> ## Role Call
> - Dave Cridland (chairing)
> - Daniel Gultsch
> - Georg Lukas
> - Kevin Smith
> - Sam Whited
> ## For fork's sake, can somebody else take the minutes?
> Georg this time
> ## Good Idea Extraction
> The "good" bits:
> XEP-0013: purge offline messages for MAM clients
> XEP-0116: full-stanza encryption
> A long discussion about the usefulness of the 0013-purge for purposes of
> MAM, Clausewitz, race conditions, users who have MAM disabled and other
> corner cases. No clear consensus on how to move on with 0013.
> General consensus on Good Idea Extraction: "it's an option"
> Further discussion of 0013/MAM should be continued on list. We need a
> proper protocol to fix the offline/MAM interop. Sam suggests to add a
> warning into 0313, then to deprecate 0013, then to work on a proper
> replacement.
> ## Dusty Drafts
> A long list of "Draft" standards was brought to the standards list. The
> Council should decide which of those will be deprecated, and which ones
> shall move to Final.
> Kev points out that a "Call for Experience" is the proper way to move
> from Draft to Final. The Council members promise to have a look at all
> listed XEPs so that a vote can take place in the next meeting to decide
> whether to CFE or to deprecate each of them.
> Sam points out that there are some obvious candidates, but further
> discussion shows that more preparation time would be appropriate.
> ## AOB
> Georg brings up multiple points:
> ### MUC reflection of message IDs
> This was discussed in 2010 and then in 2014, without gaining consensus:
> https://mail.jabber.org/pipermail/standards/2014-July/028996.html
> In the meantime, origin-id was designed as a workaround, but does not
> work universally either. Georg proposes to change 0045 wording to
> reflect current best practice, even if it would break the Draft XEP.
> He promises to prepare a PR that can be voted upon next week. Kev
> suggests some wording and asks to add a disco#info feature so that the
> breaking change is at least advertised.
> ### Removal of <origin-id/>
> As the <origin-id/> element of 0359 was introduced with the sole purpose
> of fixing the above MUC-id-rewriting problem, Georg asks to remove the
> <origin-id/> once the above issue is fixed.
> ### ID Uniqueness in RFC 6120
> Georg raises the inconsistency problems of RFC 6120 @ids being defined
> as unique within a stream, but used for end-to-end tracking. No specific
> proposal is made, so it's suggested to move the discussion to list.
> ## Time of next
> +1 weeks works for everyone but potentially Georg, who promises to try
> hard to join.

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