[Standards] XEP-0060: Item ordering

Philipp Hörist philipp at hoerist.com
Wed Aug 8 15:57:16 UTC 2018


And this brings us to the next critical question which affects all PEP
reliant XEPs

https://xmpp.org/extensions/attic/xep-0060-1.11.html#subscriber-subscribe-last

What is the last published item? The last modified item or the last
published under a new ID

Seems all PEP implementation that i know choose the last modified item
(Also ejabberd).
But if the last published item is also the last modified then it follows
that the most recent should also the last modified, otherwise i would find
this not very consistent

Regards
Philipp

2018-08-08 17:48 GMT+02:00 Timothée Jaussoin <edhelas at movim.eu>:

> Le mercredi 08 août 2018 à 16:32 +0100, Matthew Wild a écrit :
> > On 8 August 2018 at 16:17, Peter Saint-Andre <stpeter at mozilla.com>
> wrote:
> > > On 8/8/18 3:17 AM, Philipp Hörist wrote:
> > > > I always thought the most recent refers to the publish date/time of
> the
> > > > item, hence if i override a item it also changes the updated
> time/date
> > > > and it becomes the most recent
> > >
> > > That seems reasonable. So it's really "last modified item". I'm curious
> > > what Ralph thinks.
> >
> > Me too.
> >
> > I personally have always shared Philipp's interpretation. A publish of
> > an item is a publish, whether another item already existed with that
> > id or not.
>
> So it's a https://xkcd.com/1172/ case for me.
> Having a "social network" implementation using Pubsub this behavior is
> going against the current flow that I'm using in Movim.
> If you edit an article on a social network or a blog it shouldn't move
> back to the top of your feed. It is also, afaik, how ejabberd is
> handling it.
>
> In both cases, does the disco#items (https://xmpp.org/extensions/
> xep-0060.html#entity-discoveritems) and query items (
> https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0060.html#subscriber-retrieve-returnsome)
> IDs order should be consistent then? If it's the case then
> using RSM on disco#items should be enough to "refresh" what the client
> missed on a node (give me all the items published after the ID
> of the last updated item that I have in my cache) without actually having
> to compare the payloads.
>
> I'm also wondering if this affects https://xmpp.org/extensions/
> xep-0395.html.
>
> Regards,
>
> Timothée
>
> >
> > I'd say this interpretation also makes the most sense if you consider
> > the perspective of someone subscribed to the node. Requesting the
> > items will return the same items in the same order that you would have
> > received them while subscribed, with the obvious exception of items
> > that have been replaced.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Matthew
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